It's seen better days

Rhamah

Rhamah

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Louisville, KY
My ZL is letting me down :( To be fair, I let her down first and she's just paying me back. I haven't been able to give her the love she needs thanks to a new truck, new wife, and nowhere to work

First thing I did after winter was over is ride it. Was a little rough so I ran a can of Seafoam through it and it ran better for awhile. Checked the oil/final gear oil/and had the battery on a tender all winter. After the first few rides it went downhill, ending with the last few times I've attempted to ride to work and it won't start. It'll turn over just fine... until the battery dies. Then I hook her up to the truck and finally get it going.

Next thought was the battery/connections. Pulled the battery cleaned up the connections and sure enough, it was low on acid. Bought some more, filled it up, and ran it for a bit. Still had trouble starting in the morning but it was slightly better.

In the past, as well as being hard (impossible) to start, it will stall and die at red lights. Usually, it would always start back up. Not the most recent 2 morning commutes though. I would have to push it to the top of a hill, and push-start it. I thought maybe I just wasn't driving it on the freeway enough and the battery couldn't stay charged since the first and last parts of my short commute are usually stop and go traffic. But that didn't sound right.

So me and the wife (she's new, still runs great) are riding and I feel it trying to stall. So I pull into Autozone to test my "bad battery" theory and have them test it. They say it's coming up a little under 12v, but the diagnostics machine is saying I have a bad voltage regulator. So I buy one from a somewhat reputable eBay dealer and install it. For it being only one connector, and two screws, it was a surprising pain in the ass. It rains the next week so I am not able to test it. I hook it up to the truck for a bit to give it some juice.

Then this morning I try to take her to work once again and we go through the same routine. Won't start, turning over until it dies. (not constantly with my finger on the button mind you, 3-4 second intervals until you could tell it was dying). I hook it up to the truck and it starts. I let it idle a minute or two still hooked up and take off. Then it stalls about 2 miles down the road at a stoplight. I should mention this time, the Tach wasn't working when it started. I get to the top of the hill, push start it, and magically the tach starts working again.

Here's where I'm thinking the problems may be:

1. Bad battery. (possible, it's only a couple years old but it was an eBay buy)
2. New voltage regulator is a POS. (possible, but not likely)
3. I've got one of those gremlins in my electrical system we all love. (please no)


I'm really hoping someone tells me it's a random $5 part that will fix all my problems and get me +100HP and an extra 30mpg. AND is installed by 3 screws right under the seat.
 
Take the battery out and charge it. Take the battery to AutoZone and have them load test it.

Do you have a voltmeter? You can get one from AutoZone, Sears, etc for $20 on up. Get a digital one.

With a know good battery installed, connect the voltmeter to the battery. When you rev the engine, the battery voltage should rise. On the 900/1000, should go up to 13.5-13.8. If the voltage does not rise when revving the engine, you have a charging problem.
 
The only time I've seen the tach on my ZL600 go crazy was if the battery was bad. Did you buy a used voltage regulator from eBay or a new one? If you download the gpz600 manual and the zl600a supplement it should tell you how to check the stator and voltage regulator. The charging system on the bike isn't big enough to charge an almost dead battery . the things you are describing sounds like a bad voltage regulator to me.

I purchased a new VR from a mower repair shop in Minnesota for $70.

Charge the battery on a trickle charger for a few days and try agsin . if it goes flat riding it , I would invest in new VR

Much good luck
 
kawboy said:
Take the battery out and charge it. Take the battery to AutoZone and have them load test it.

Do you have a voltmeter? You can get one from AutoZone, Sears, etc for $20 on up. Get a digital one.

With a know good battery installed, connect the voltmeter to the battery. When you rev the engine, the battery voltage should rise. On the 900/1000, should go up to 13.5-13.8. If the voltage does not rise when revving the engine, you have a charging problem.
Click to expand...


I've already done that. That's where I got the "a little under 12v" figure from. But that was when the acid was a little low. When they tested it on the bike, it threw the "bad voltage regulator". I'll have to see about getting a voltmeter, this isn't the first time I've needed one.


jmassengill said:
The only time I've seen the tach on my ZL600 go crazy was if the battery was bad. Did you buy a used voltage regulator from eBay or a new one? If you download the gpz600 manual and the zl600a supplement it should tell you how to check the stator and voltage regulator. The charging system on the bike isn't big enough to charge an almost dead battery . the things you are describing sounds like a bad voltage regulator to me.

I purchased a new VR from a mower repair shop in Minnesota for $70.

Charge the battery on a trickle charger for a few days and try agsin . if it goes flat riding it , I would invest in new VR

Much good luck
Click to expand...


The voltage regulator was new. And even when I was actually driving, the Tach was not moving. It wasn't until push starting it that it started registering. So you're saying it may have just been dying because it was too low to begin with and can't keep up?
 
A little under 12 is not good. A fully charged battery should be at least 12.6.
 
It wasn't fully charged. It was low on acid. Which is why I had it tested on the bike AFTER I filled it with acid and charged it again. Sorry I should have been more clear. First test came out a little under 12v while it was low on acid. 2nd test was battery in bike and it said my voltage regulator was bad.
 
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I think the folks are saying to start over again. Check the voltage on the battery with the bike not running s/b 12.6 volts. If it isn't and less then start there, charge the battery off the bike and have it tested under load (off the bike). Until you know you have a good functioning battery then doesn't help to dig into other problems. Now if the battery is fine, then with the bike running (I know funny), test the voltage to the battery, should be 14+ volts and should vary a little with the twist of the throttle. Once you know that is all working properly and the bike still doesn't run right then off to other areas to troubleshoot.
 
:hello: You can disconnect your battery & charge at 2 amps over night. Then check the voltage. Let it sit for 3 hours or so. Check the voltage again. If it drops below 12 volts replace the battery. Most of the time when a battery looses its acid it can't be revived for very long. My charging system in my bike is as follows with new battery. Battery sitting over night 13.2 volts. Hit the starter voltage drops to 11.5 volts. At 2000 RPM or > the voltage climbs to 14.4 volts. Not all batteries or charging systems are the same but these # will give to a reference/starting point.
 
Two important things to look at on the 600 for hard starting problems. First is to make sure the valves are set correctly. If you have not adjusted them to proper spec, then please do so. The second issue with the 600 is the cdi unit. These are known to go bad on the 6. I would remove the cdi and clean the contacts, then put some electrical grease on the contacts and reinstall. Lastly on the cdi, the next time you are having hard start symptoms try wiggling the wiring connection on the cdi and see if this helps. And yea, double check the battery.
 
Thanks for the advice guys. After charging the battery overnight I threw it back on the bike and went to Advance (2mi away). It took about 2min to finally catch and then it died on the turn in to the store. I try to fire it up and it turns over, but starts lugging (like the battery is low) after about a min. So instead of doing half measures I went ahead and replaced the battery. Had to get a ride home, filled it, charged it, and came back and installed it. It turned over spectacularly and caught fairly quickly, but my headlights started acting funny. They were on when the key was turned, but when the engine was running, they turned OFF! I assume I have a bad ground and it couldn't handle firing the engine AND all the lights. BTW, what's the black and yellow wire running along the left (negative) side of the battery compartment? Do I attach that to the ground post, or try and find a spot on the frame to ground to?

I'm hoping to get a little fresh gas with a bit of Seafoam, attach a fully charged battery, and ground that mystery wire and my troubles will be over. If not, I'm going to have to do some chasing.
 
:hello: Black with yellow stripe is a secondary ground. It goes many places tying/looping all your grounds together through out the wiring harness. Your wiring harness should have a single wire lead that the wire plugs into. It should be located were the sub frame meets the main frame on the same side as your battery. It will be sticking out of the harness about an inch or so. Furchin may know for sure of the exact location. Also make sure your main ground wire from the negative battery terminal has a good ground to the frame. No rust or corrosion at either end. I used a S S allan cap screw with S S lock washer to bolt the ground wire to the frame.
 
So far it has a new battery. New Voltage Regulator. New gas. Seafoam treatment. And I've just sent the carbs off to be cleaned/repaired. BTW does anyone know if the rejetting kit is supposed to have a bigger pilot jet than the stock #35? The main jet is a #136 but the guy cleaning says that usually the pilot replaced with a wider one when the main is. I'm running 4 K&N oval pods btw, and the PO jetted it. I don't know which kit he used or what he may have missed.

R. J.


Yea, I had that grounded to the battery. Grounding it to the frame fixed the headlight issue. Thanks.
 
I did not replace the pilot jets on my 600 when I went to pods. Some people have and some have not. As to the size of your main jets, 136 sounds way to big. I think mine are around 106. I realize that there is a difference between manufacturers numbers in relation to sizing though.
 
Is there any benefit to changing the pilots? I haven't really had any trouble out of the main jet range, it's under 2K rpm that all my trouble seems to come from. Then again, since the previous owner is the one who did the install, I've never had it any other way. So I wouldn't know if it wasn't as responsive as it used to be or not.

The Dynojet and 6Sigma are the only jet kits I could find. I have no idea what's in the 6Sigma, but the Dynojet only have mains #130 and #134 with their jet kits, no pilots.
 
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Rhamah said:
It wasn't fully charged. It was low on acid. Which is why I had it tested on the bike AFTER I filled it with acid and charged it again. Sorry I should have been more clear. First test came out a little under 12v while it was low on acid. 2nd test was battery in bike and it said my voltage regulator was bad.
Click to expand...

What was the voltage during the second test? I see the diagnosis was a bad regulator but you did not mention the voltage during the second test.

Al
 
Rhamah said:
Is there any benefit to changing the pilots? I haven't really had any trouble out of the main jet range, it's under 2K rpm that all my trouble seems to come from. Then again, since the previous owner is the one who did the install, I've never had it any other way. So I wouldn't know if it wasn't as responsive as it used to be or not.

The Dynojet and 6Sigma are the only jet kits I could find. I have no idea what's in the 6Sigma, but the Dynojet only have mains #130 and #134 with their jet kits, no pilots.
Click to expand...

DynoJet has a different number scheme. Here is a link to the conversion chart.

http://www.jetsrus.com/FAQs/FAQ_mikuni_vs_dynojet_vs_keihin_sizes.htm

http://www.klr650.net/archives/keihin_cvk40/jet_conversion_chart.html

Al
 
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ssbn610g said:
What was the voltage during the second test? I see the diagnosis was a bad regulator but you did not mention the voltage during the second test.

Al
Click to expand...

Under 12v again. There was a setting on the tester that said "bad voltage regulator". And it was pretty cheap so I just replaced it.
 
Is there any benefit to changing the pilots?---------------Can't really give you an answer to that.

For your reference I have a K&N jet kit on mine, part # 81-9079.

Stay away from the sigma kit, you do not get what you need.
 
What plug wires are you running? I had all kinds of running and starting issues about 50miles after I put in suppression core plug wires instead of classic copper core wires. Could hardly ever start her unless I jumped it with a big battery. Make sure the resistor caps in your spark plug caps are clean and providing equal resistance,and that your plug wire ends are clean and all the same length. Once I switched back to regular unsuppressed copper core wires,dying at idle and difficult starts disappeared. I must have adjusted my valves 3 or 4 times before I figured it out. Lol
 
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